http://time.com/5143747/obama-presidential-portrait-kehinde-wiley/

Just happened so I don't think hi-res images are circulating yet, but like a lot of us, I've been following Kehinde for a while and it's dope that his work is gonna be in the Smithsonian's Portrait Gallery.

I wish CNN woulda let Kehinde and Amy's speech play instead of bringing on the talking heads for useless commentary.

I love the Kehinde piece, I'm not as much a fan of that particular Amy Sherald piece. Im no art critique but it looked unfinished to me.

yeah

i'm not well versed in art

But I was in tears seeing Kehinde's exhibit at the Brooklyn Museum of Art. Powerful stuff.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

continue the effeminization of the black male nonstop

i personally think it’s disgusting

begin.


How Sway??



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

Cats gonna front like that painting of Obama aint effeminate? lol

i saw his installation at Brooklyn Museum... smfh.

here's what the village voice had to say about it...lol. For non-NYCers the voice is THEE GAY publication

https://www.villagevoice.com/2015/03/11/what-to-make-of-kehinde-wileys-pervy-brooklyn-museum-retrospective/

If you think you recognize one of the paintings from the Fox evening soap Empire on the walls of the Brooklyn Museum’s Kehinde Wiley retrospective, you’re only half wrong.

By now the Wiley formula is so familiar — and so legible on TV — that it operates as a shorthand for black empowerment: His well-known portraits of young men from the projects dropped into Old Masterish settings are the black figurative equivalent of Thomas Kinkade. On the Fox show, music mogul Lucious Lyon has at least two Wileys in his New York City pad, and a monster-size canvas of a Timberland-shod swashbuckler (titled Officer of the Hussars and owned in real life by
the Detroit Institute of Art) presides over the living room of rapper Hakeem Lyon,
Lucious’s son. In the current show on view at the Brooklyn Museum, dozens
of near-identical canvases repeat Wiley’s brand of African-American uplift.


But look closer at the 50-some objects — painting, sculpture, stained glass — in “Kehinde Wiley: A New Republic,” and you’ll see predatory behavior dressed up as art-historical affirmative action. Wiley’s targets are young people of color who in these pictures are gussied up in the trappings of art history or Givenchy. Judging from Wiley’s market and institutional
success — in his fifteen-year career, this is his second solo at the Brooklyn Museum — Wiley has proven himself a canny operator seducing an art public cowed by political correctness and willing to gloss over the more lurid implications of the 38-year-old artist’s production.

Wiley’s Passing/Posing and Rumors
of War series consist of massively scaled, color-saturated paintings that feature handsome young black men — plucked from the dicier blocks of Harlem and Bed-Stuy (back when row houses didn’t command seven digits) — astride a horse or leaning jauntily on a cane, like Napoleon or a nobleman. Instead of the rocky outcroppings and interiors that background the originals from which he borrows, Wiley deploys textile patterns that flatten time and obliterate place. Down, his series of billboard-size canvases of lounging odalisques, finds the artist’s male models with their underwear pulled down to reveal a few inches of abdomen and their lips moist and open in the manner of a classical Venus.

Wiley renders his models’ pecs, thighs, and cheekbones in warm caramels. Most wear their street clothes, so it’s Timberlands and Nikes digging into the stirrups and Hanes underwear riding low. The biceps of young Morpheus — not the Laurence Fishburne character from The Matrix but a riff on eighteenth-century French sculptor Jean-Antoine Houdon’s portrayal of the mythical god
of dreams — evince an almost photo-real perfection. Wiley, who says he paints the central figures himself (the painstaking labor of the patterned backgrounds he outsources to assistants in a global network of studios), layers on thin washes
of oil to luminous effect.


It’s easy to see why these images have become that shorthand. On their surface, the figures are commanding. Wiley’s juxtapositions of high and low, street and
academe, are subversive but not too much so. Their placement in look-at-me gilded frames gives them gravitas. If we wanted, we could stop right here, give two thumbs up to learned street cred, and praise Wiley for his business acumen. “I make really high-priced luxury goods for wealthy consumers,” the painter told the Art Newspaper in 2008.

Where once was a powerful white
man, Wiley inserts a firm piece of African-American flesh. Where white power aggrandized itself in official state portraiture, now young blacks from the ghetto, the ones newspaper headlines insist are without future and en route to incarceration, straddle stallions. What does it mean to put a young black man on a horse and call him Napoleon? If it isn’t dangling a fantasy and false hope, then at least it implies that young
urban blacks are in desperate need of
uplift. You call that empowerment?

And then there is Wiley’s casting-couch method. In the early 2000s, after
he graduated from Yale, Wiley did a residency at the Studio Museum and began inviting men he met on the streets into his studio to pose. “When I’m approaching these guys, there’s a presupposed engagement,” Wiley said in the 2008 Art Newspaper interview. “I don’t ask people what their sexualities are, but there’s a sense in which male beauty is being negotiated.”

Once in the studio, Wiley presents
his model with art-history books and asks him to choose which painting he’d like to be in. Straining to legitimize this method, Brooklyn Museum curator Eugenie Tsai lauds the artist in the exhibition catalog for “the subject’s active participation” in
a “collaborative encounter…co-produced by the subject and the artist.”

What Wiley and his subjects do behind the scenes may be none of our business, but his paintings kiss and tell. Saint Andrew grinds his crotch against a wooden cross, and in case we don’t quite get it, Wiley has painted free-floating spermatozoa across the canvas. The same goes for the bear of a fellow in Napoleon Leading the Army Over the Alps, which could be subtitled “(Through a Light Ejaculate Mist).” And if the painted
tadpoles aren’t sufficiently suggestive, several of the gilded frames contain sperm reliefs of their own. (Talk about painting outside the lines.)

In what world is a Yale-minted artist who lures young men into his studio
with the promise of power and glamour not predatory? These aren’t portraits. They’re types — to the point where
the majority of his titles reflect only the identity of the original sitter; his models remain anonymous.


Like many perpetrators, Wiley has moments of grace. Some are conjured by Tsai, who whips a fifteen-year career of deadening sameness into something vaguely dynamic by showing variously sized works and media. The most beautiful and humane images, presented in the exhibition’s final room, are Wiley’s 2013 reinterpretations of fifteenth-century Flemish painter Hans Memling’s portraits of wealthy merchants. The figures in a trio
of small panels embedded into altar-like wood surrounds possess a humanity that goes missing in the flash of Wiley’s mural-size works. After Memling’s Portrait of a Man in a Red Hat is ethereal, yet so solid that he makes a case for Wiley’s skills.
Perhaps tellingly, each painting in this
series includes the model’s name.

Do instances such as this one validate
the rest of Wiley’s output or render his methods less perverse? We’ll never know. Having discovered the art world’s weakness, Wiley has painted himself as untouchable.

http://jessicadawson.com/

Who leans on the stereotype of black man as sexual predator with no basis other than inference and innuendo.

okay.

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

saying their object is to make black people "comfortable" with homosexuality

wiley aint painting pics of gay women though

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/01/20/lee-daniels-empire-homophobia-black-_n_6507274.html

its a reason his pics are featured heavily in empire

you STFU

and I wasn't familiar with Amy Sherald's work
But

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/twitter-users-noticed-something-about-amy-sheralds-portrait-of-michelle-obama/article/2648816

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DV2FGAYUMAAwI6o.jpg:large

Not a fan of it but it’s art. I guess it’s dope to have a different portrait than the traditional ones.

the images there with larger dimensions really show more of her talent:
http://www.amysherald.com/k8ralybv3u4o2b57ygpdwxxztd9plt

Her CV is really impressive too.

Amy's work is amazing in person. She mixes paint a specific way for her portraits and in person, her work has a depth that maintains the aesthetic of a painting, but has some of the depth of a photo. That is the only way I can explain it. And she paints on scale, so they are always large paintings.

https://artsy-media-uploads.s3.amazonaws.com/lypywFh35ACo6ZkthEdw9w%2FThe+Snowy+Day+Peter+Bed_p+copy.jpg

Knew it reminded me of something

That Time Magazine link (in the OP) to an article that has a brief explanation about why the artists chose that grayish hue.

“Bold colors and patterns are a constant in Sherald’s work — from the bright red fascinator adorned by the young Miss Everything to the multi-colored print dress that pops from the canvas of her 2017 work, Untitled — but the skin of her African American subjects is often presented in varying shades of gray. She has also been said to seek out subjects who she sees as “existing in the past, present, and future simultaneously,” according to Artnet.”

lol

I know Wiley's signature is the use of the background patterns, but it's distracting here imo. Michelle's picture is just as vibrant in a more restrained way and there is something quite universal in her painting that's missing from his.

i need to look into previous presidential portraits, i was expecting a plain realism portrait

art needs time to truly appreciate

I loveeeee JFK's picture too, definitely one of the more modern of the bunch.

once i saw that there were other portraits that tried something other than plain realism i got a different appreciation for these. felt kind of weird if these were the only ones that went in a different direction. seeing its not the case, im with it.

feels weird saying that cuz we shouldnt be afraid to be different but i guess with the importance of it im a little sensitive to wanting these to be accepted.

I don't love them, but I don't hate either.

>yet, but like a lot of us, I've been following Kehinde for a
>while and it's dope that his work is gonna be in the
>Smithsonian's Portrait Gallery.

He's already in there, his portrait of L.L. has been up for several years.

https://twitter.com/nelson_atkins/status/913838155937255424

And I have to say that the Obama portrait I would need to see in person to truly get a feel for. This painting also seems underwhelming on a computer screen, but in person at its massive scale and color range it's hard to look - or walk - away from.

~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz

much rather they used a New Orleans painter

I was expecting traditional portrait oil paintings. The same every president and first lady before the Obamas, received. Not this cartoonish/modern crap. Folks will like what they like. But the Obamas deserve to have their legacy memorialized in the same fashion of every presidency before them.

Something more like this better!?!?

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/9d/36/00/9d36003af74e41318133bcd5b185e026.jpg




**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

edit

So Airbreed is okay with Clinton having this
https://americaspresidents.si.edu/sites/default/files/styles/original/public/l_npg_5_2009-clinton_sm.jpg?itok=nQeri499

But not with Kehinde's Obama





Bush II
https://americaspresidents.si.edu/sites/default/files/styles/original/public/npg_2008_51-bush_sm.jpg?itok=1dxnFeO_

Reagan
https://americaspresidents.si.edu/sites/default/files/styles/original/public/npg_93_384-reagan_sm.jpg?itok=MI3hKpBz

JFK
https://americaspresidents.si.edu/sites/default/files/styles/original/public/npg_99_75-jfk-hr_sm.jpg?itok=ApoOHYg7


But the Obama is a problem. FOH.

https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2015/05/11/dekooning-jfk-getty_wide-8dfb88b0dd5b1a7efe49d612a9e6067a3cc5bb38.jpg

https://www.designboom.com/art/george-w-bush-exhibit-painted-portraits-04-07-2014/

https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2015-02/3/19/campaign_images/webdr07/this-is-an-actual-portrait-of-bobby-jindal-that-h-2-24640-1423009470-2_dblbig.jpg

https://photos.vanityfair.com/2015/01/29/54ca9ec9b8f23e3a031463fe_image.png

http://hyperallergic.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/bush-deadiraqi-640.jpg

that photo looks like she's working out some kind of trauma

In de Kooning's case, JFK's restless nature made it difficult for her to paint a portrait as she normally would. Instead of a traditional sitting, she had to prepare several sketches and workshop until she got the final canvas:

http://www.artnews.com/2015/04/10/a-president-seen-from-every-angle-elaine-de-kooning-on-painting-jfk-in-1964/

.

I didn't realize that they were these types of "artistic" portraits.

I was thinking it was like these formal things: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portraits_of_Presidents_of_the_United_States

If my grandfather were alive he'd be on it.

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

not sure why she went more muted for Michelle.

i think her portrait would look better next to Kehinde's if she went with her usual high contrast approach.

No they aren't, this is like the rest of them.
Even the other portrait she has on display at the NPG styled similarly.
Grayscale is her trademark.

are typically bright and in contrast to the muted blackness.

My favorite piece of her's is one here in DC at the national museum of women in the arts and it is this really bold hot pink background and it's so vibrant in person and in pictures I've seen online.

Disappointed she went muted on this one, I wonder if she felt she had to because of the weight of her subject...

Also I wish she had her standing, like she has folks in her other portraits.

>Disappointed she went muted on this one, I wonder if she felt
>she had to because of the weight of her subject...
>
>Also I wish she had her standing, like she has folks in her
>other portraits.

I'm positive Michelle Obama isn't disappointed.

This is an iterative process... none of this was a surprise.

There's something about the face that's off.

That's not Michelle.....that's Tisha in accounting.
---------------------------------------


---------------------------------------

I waited on two long lines and saw both in person today. Your claim, similar to those also seen on Twitter, is an unfounded one.

The head and facial features don't look accurate to me. I think the shape of Michelle's head and shoulders are off. The pose doesn't really capture Michelle's posture to me.

liking it (at least FLOTUS' painting).

Seems like it would be a betrayal to say they don't dig it.




**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

i wish they had the artists do both in a portrait. that way there could at least be a matching set.

From what I can see though, the resemblance is a bit lacking on Michelle's.
Dope that they are really letting these be art, and not just following in the mold of all the stuffy formal portraits that came before.

her standing like the majority of the other portraits by Amy are.

lifesize portraiture.
She executes both excellently.
44thFLOTUS' head is proportionally sized.

i like the art, but the poses were poor choices for the purpose of these portraits

GOAT of bullshit maybe

kerry james marshall is the man. kehinde wiley is a psychopath.

have you seen this niggas pictures? lol

have you seen empire, precious, monster's ball, paperboy etc

these are two of the most black hating, psychopaths we've seen since alice walker

smfh

Aside, neither are effeminate.

i meant "paintings" as in wiley's

i know they different... but they moving in the same direction

i didnt even say they were effeminate though... i said thats the imagery they pushing

admittedly, with their own words

though I'm no lee daniels fan, wiley's art is the shit!
he's been promoting the same type of Black empowerment you seem to champion, in a way that flips stylings seen in the work of the 'old masters'--painting european aristocrats--with an array of Black folk instead.

>though I'm no lee daniels fan, wiley's art is the shit!
>he's been promoting the same type of Black empowerment you
>seem to champion, in a way that flips stylings seen in the
>work of the 'old masters'--painting european aristocrats--with
>an array of Black folk instead.

What is he 'championing?' l

the excellence of Black folk

>though I'm no lee daniels fan, wiley's art is the shit!
>he's been promoting the same type of Black empowerment you
>seem to champion, in a way that flips stylings seen in the
>work of the 'old masters'--painting european aristocrats--with
>an array of Black folk instead.

painting black people into remixes of european aristocrat paintings is black empowerment?

nah..thats nothing like i champion

kerry james marshall though?? yeah...

what could be construed as homophobia?

exactly

http://media.mlive.com/entertainment/detroit_impact/photo/kehinde-wiley--a313967fca297d2f.png

https://i2.wp.com/www.culturetype.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/EL137.13.jpg

https://mrsawyersopus.files.wordpress.com/2010/10/2319992318_7592b0e4a7-1.jpg?w=580

https://res.cloudinary.com/sagacity/image/upload/c_crop,h_619,w_1000,x_0,y_0/c_limit,f_auto,fl_lossy,q_80,w_1080/Wiley_Morpheus_xwt7pi.jpg

The men do look “effeminate” in the sense that

1. It was en vogue in the classical era for men of status to be more “beautiful” in appearance akin to a woman. Something seen among representations of European, Asian, ancient Egyptian, etc. royalty.

So to me the connection is comparing black men who are seen largely as thugs in American society as royalty and beautiful

2. For the reclined poses again it looks like a callback to reneissance era and later portraits of what is called “odalisque (sp?)” the reclining nude white woman (and its variations) are born of the white slave trade to Europe, Africa, and Middle/Far East. Playboys are/were ”modern” day odalisques (the readily available white slave girl aka the girl next door)

The artist appears to have flipped the subject from classically enslaved white woman with whom one could have their way to the modern enslaved black male with whom any white authority could have the same

Honestly the Obama painting is pretty subtle by comparison. I didn’t quite get the messaging of the artist until I saw these others

Interesting lecture on the subject
https://youtu.be/8iZDapgQdFo

Well that Obama portrait could have been worse.

>http://media.mlive.com/entertainment/detroit_impact/photo/kehinde-wiley--a313967fca297d2f.png
>
>https://i2.wp.com/www.culturetype.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/EL137.13.jpg
>
>https://mrsawyersopus.files.wordpress.com/2010/10/2319992318_7592b0e4a7-1.jpg?w=580
>
>https://res.cloudinary.com/sagacity/image/upload/c_crop,h_619,w_1000,x_0,y_0/c_limit,f_auto,fl_lossy,q_80,w_1080/Wiley_Morpheus_xwt7pi.jpg

Not a stretch to say he's just painting from his perspective on the black male. That doesn't equate to conspiracy.


______________________________________________________________________________

cscpov.blogspot.com

"There's a fine line between persistence and foolishness..."
-unknown

"To Each His Reach"

i said lee daniels and kehinde wiley

i was called a conspiracy theorist

just sayin'

all those dudes look mad soft.

and I wonder if he would get this much recognition if the men in these photos were more powerful

and why is soft being conflated with gay?

when I look at those paintings I see art historical references while also subverting the format of renaissance imagery

NOT some evil agenda where the focus is to depict black men as un-masculine which in itself is kinda problematic because it suggests that femininity is a bad thing

Dudes wearing stockings but how many illegitimate sons you think he got?

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/68/

You could buy a white woman at the market when this was painted

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/12/William_Etty_-_A_young_women_reclining_on_a_fur_rug.jpg

Same shit

here are some more fun ones


the illest lacefront AND in a suit of armor looking like a dandy
http://hoocher.com/Louis_XIV/Louis_de_France_Le_Grand_Dauphin.jpg

and of course America's darling racist luciferian
http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/7163/1522/1600/George-Washington.jpg

you can not like the art, but don't be an asshole and act like you aren't seeing what the man is doing.

he keeps harping on the one with the small semen painted on it...forgetting that these are MASSIVE (for scale: https://culturestories.co/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/WILEY-at-Brooklyn-2015_10-e1476184041944.jpg ) pieces and that particular piece - the only one with the semen on it - is dominated by a man on a horse in U.S. Army camouflage, taking a charge stance in front of a mural of ovaries.

For more scale: http://smarthistory.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/red.png
Original Napoleon piece: https://mkmcdonald.files.wordpress.com/2012/10/wiley1.png?w=560

(arguably, Wiley's modern version also poses and appears more masculine than Napoleon in the original)

Even in THAT instance he refuses to look past "black man surrounded by semen" to see that the painting is clearly one of Wiley's most heterosexual pieces. It's also a feminist piece, clearly, but it is undeniably from a heterosexual male perspective.

So...I guess it's not a stretch to say he'd overlook all the 18th century art...not even references really but direct lifts in the poses he chooses.

not trying to be funny either.

Shit is gay yo, plain and simple. You called it.

daniels has SAID its the whole reason for empire lol...and as i said - have you seen his movies?

every painting wiley makes of black men are effeminate.

he has sperm circling around them and their asses hanging out

wtf

you coulda just said that upfront.

dichotomous thinking

i havent said 1 negative thing about gay people in the post

i have said negative things about two gay guys and the work they choose to present to the world

so i was called a conspiracy theorist for saying they promoted effeminate imagery of black men (although they are on record)

then i provide the proof of said characterization and its "so youre sort of a homophobe". i also provided a link and a swipe where the village voice came to a similar conclusion... but again lets just overlook everything that doesnt fit our "catchphrase" narrative.

group think programmed muh fuckas

His keystrokes is clear as shit.

Cuz your argument is that Wiley is effeminizing black male by daring to have as his subject matter gay black effeminate men.

That conclusion that doesn't follow at all.

It's the same argument Alt-Right make when they argue that by promoting black characters in movies is some how an attack on whiteness. Depicting Nick Fury as Black somehow is a conspiracy to undermined whiteness.

You've turned inclusiveness into an attack on the dominant group.

It's also text book homophobia because your suggesting is that by depicting some effeminate gay (possibly to probably) men he is effeminizing ALL black men. That's text book homophobia to suggest associating with gayness somehow makes heteros "gayer" by association.

And the idea that the Obama picture is somehow effeminate says more about your insecurities about manhood than it does about anything else.




>daniels has SAID its the whole reason for empire lol...and as
>i said - have you seen his movies?
>
>every painting wiley makes of black men are effeminate.
>
>he has sperm circling around them and their asses hanging out
>
>wtf
>
>


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

Like Mister Burns

That’s at the root of white identity

Solid statement nonetheless though

So only a racist gets worked up about color-blind inclusive casting that leads to a black person playing that role.

Same way only a homophobe gets worked up by an artist saying he wants to expose black people to more gay/feminine black male subjects.

A secure black male should not lose an ounce of sleep over that.

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

I’m just saying it’s in the culture of whites in general to take that type of re envisioning as an attack. It’s a “natural” and necessary response in order for society as they know it to continue.

White folks that are rational in regard to skin color and identity are outliers.

why is he portrayed that way (feminine)?

i just showed the pics to my class and ask their thoughts

they said “they trying to say he’s soft”

and if you read the village voice article i linked... wiley says he never has the sexuality convo with his subjects. so he don’t know if they gay or not so your major point is based on a false assumption

Wiley said in the 2008 Art Newspaper interview. “I don’t ask people what their sexualities are, but there’s a sense in which male beauty is being negotiated.”

Some of Wileys other pieces sure, but Obama, nah thats you seeing what you wanna see homie. hmmm


BUT BUT your teenagers are co-signing you...LMAO


P.S.


might be a lil Downey in this pic too since were Poasting

https://f4.bcbits.com/img/a2927528448_10.jpg

>BUT BUT your teenagers are co-signing you...LMAO

man they dont know what i think about it

theres about 8 black male teachers in the school. 8/8 said the pic is funny style

Cause flowers are in it?

You should be spending more time questioning why you reflexively consider the portrait feminine than trying to argue it is.

More importantly, you should be challenging your student's notion of masculinity than co-signing them or using them as a source of authority on what is masculine and notions of manhood.

I am a man, raised by a strong father, trying to raise two boys into strong men. Nothing about this strikes me as feminine. I trust my notions of manhood more than your students.


Random Side Question: Do you think Cam'ron is feminized when he wears Pink gear?

>why is he portrayed that way (feminine)?
>
>i just showed the pics to my class and ask their thoughts
>
>they said “they trying to say he’s soft”
>
>and if you read the village voice article i linked... wiley
>says he never has the sexuality convo with his subjects. so he
>don’t know if they gay or not so your major point is based
>on a false assumption


No this proves my point. without knowing the sexuality of his subjects, how do you assume that he is feminizing his subjects? He has plenty of paintings in which the male subjects don't assume any sort of what you are stereotyping as feminine poses. So why assume the ones who do have feminine poses were feminized by Wiley (as oppose to be naturally feminine subjects?)





**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

multiple times in jiujitsu class


:(

your ass feminizing the community

its how gay people were created.

All gay dudes are guys who are victims of touch of death in their past life. That final death touch performed by another man sealed their fate for gayness in their next life.

he would have made it possible for them to procreate

man + woman = life

man + man = death

woman + woman = who even cares

>More importantly, you should be challenging your student's
>notion of masculinity than co-signing them or using them as a
>source of authority on what is masculine and notions of
>manhood.


man you don't know what the conversation was. every class starts with an image, a graph, an excerpt etc and they speak - i don't


>I am a man, raised by a strong father, trying to raise two
>boys into strong men. Nothing about this strikes me as
>feminine. I trust my notions of manhood more than your
>students.

well myself and MANY others disagree with you... right in this post. you came in gun blazing about how you loved the pics. you can't say anything else at this point.

>Random Side Question: Do you think Cam'ron is feminized when
>he wears Pink gear?

Camron WAS feminized with the pink gear and the big diamond earrings. Who do you think styled him? lol.


>No this proves my point. without knowing the sexuality of his
>subjects, how do you assume that he is feminizing his
>subjects? He has plenty of paintings in which the male
>subjects don't assume any sort of what you are stereotyping as
>feminine poses. So why assume the ones who do have feminine
>poses were feminized by Wiley (as oppose to be naturally
>feminine subjects?)

In the quote Wiley says "there's a sense in which male beauty is being negotiated"

which is exactly my sentiment translated.

Not sure why you think black masculinity is so under threat and what that means for you and yours, but those issues are beyond the capacity of this post to resolve. A pill and/or a couch is likely in order.

Good luck, though.

probably a bunch of skinny jean teens he can help masculine up though, so + 1 on that side

>Not sure why you think black masculinity is so under threat
>and what that means for you and yours, but those issues are
>beyond the capacity of this post to resolve. A pill and/or a
>couch is likely in order.
>
>Good luck, though.

when hasnt black masculinity been under threat in the U.S.?

These 'masculinity' discussions are beyond stupid. Again, good luck, though...

As if the hypermasculinity that's been forced on us for generations hasn't been incredibly damaging. Any a shift away from that bullshit is "feminizing"
If that's what a motherfucker believes, they're not even worth engaging with, imo.

didnt think before u typed out that whole "why do you feel black masculinity is under attack" - did you?

and he's a teacher?

education wept.

is being negotiated" mean to you?

I do not think it means what you think it means.




>>More importantly, you should be challenging your student's
>>notion of masculinity than co-signing them or using them as
>a
>>source of authority on what is masculine and notions of
>>manhood.
>
>
>man you don't know what the conversation was. every class
>starts with an image, a graph, an excerpt etc and they speak -
>i don't.


I still don't what the conversation was. Nothing in your reference to your class is that clear here, and yet you use it as an example to make your argument. So let's agree there is no persuasive value in you bringing it up.


But let's get back to my original question you didn't answer. What about that picture is feminine to you?


>
>
>>I am a man, raised by a strong father, trying to raise two
>>boys into strong men. Nothing about this strikes me as
>>feminine. I trust my notions of manhood more than your
>>students.
>
>well myself and MANY others disagree with you... right in this
>post. you came in gun blazing about how you loved the pics.
>you can't say anything else at this point.


Other people disliked the work but what many other people agreed with you in this post regarding the feminization issue? You seemed pretty alone on that one.


Also I didn't say I loved the pics in the first post. I said I am big fan of the artist. At any rate. And? So I don't get an opinion because I like the artist but you dislike the artist but you get an opinion? How does that work in your mind?




>
>>Random Side Question: Do you think Cam'ron is feminized when
>>he wears Pink gear?
>
>Camron WAS feminized with the pink gear and the big diamond
>earrings. Who do you think styled him? lol.


>
>>No this proves my point. without knowing the sexuality of
>his
>>subjects, how do you assume that he is feminizing his
>>subjects? He has plenty of paintings in which the male
>>subjects don't assume any sort of what you are stereotyping
>as
>>feminine poses. So why assume the ones who do have feminine
>>poses were feminized by Wiley (as oppose to be naturally
>>feminine subjects?)
>
>In the quote Wiley says "there's a sense in which male beauty
>is being negotiated"


Man you cited this quote like 10 times. What do you think it means?


>
>which is exactly my sentiment translated.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

fam... every male teacher in my school said that shit is funny style

if you dont see it... thats fine too. art is up for interpretation - no?

and the quote...

wiley said his portraits are "negotiating" male beauty...

negotiate implies a give and take between ideals. what ideals are being negotiated? - the masculine/effeminate

https://www.google.com/search?q=william+morris+wallpaper&safe=off&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiv-6y6uKPZAhWBjlkKHZjpBfYQ_AUICigB&biw=1225&bih=690

look at dudes other paintings, he references patterns all the time.

why cant he be next to a race car or something cool

Looks like a fugazi designer print

LOVE Michelle's.

>Looks like a fugazi designer print
>
>LOVE Michelle's.

agree

and I get a weird vibe from both

at the work of a psychopath

.

It's not that difficult. You probably just don't like to think about things.

Folks arent used to spending time just looking at and reading a still image longer than a few seconds.

Some good art you have to cultivated taste to appreciate (e.g, get all the references in the work).


I do think Great art anyone can appreciate and people with cultivated taste can appreciate and it works on both levels.



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

I'm talking about effort, interest, humility, and a willingness to learn.

Maybe that kind of thing gets easier with practice, but that doesn't mean any kind of deep education is necessary.

I should also note: I'm not trying to say that people who aren't interested in art are 'bad people', I'm just saying they should admit when they aren't interested in art, rather than insinuating something they don't understand is 'wrong.'

you can't have an opinion on something you don't take the time to read

either?

But people don't go around bragging about their ignorance of old art. They're just as oblivious, but not as virulent about it.

I'm far more interested in the symbolism of the pieces and the artists chosen then the actual work itself.

long for them to grow on me.

I love everything about these portraits, from process to product <3


Can't help but love the Obamas.

Maybe on purpose?

the placement of the ring shows that's definitely just a trick of the eye


~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz

>

Obama looks like Joe Biden; they WERE 'tight'

Michelle looks 'soft'; I feel like the artist 'got over' by graying her out. You don't see the 'stereotypical angry black woman' scowl, you can't see any facial lines. Michelle looks like Malia, actrually - kinda girlish.

sometimes the flavors gotta soak in. Kinda like how italian food usually taste better the next day.

The paintings of black women decapitating white women.
https://s.hdnux.com/photos/71/36/54/15067916/9/920x920.jpg
“It’s sort of a play on the ‘kill whitey’ thing,” Mr. Wiley told The New Yorker in a 2012 interview.


I had to struggle to find a link that wasn't to one of "those" sites. But the argument is a "what if the races were reversed" type of thing.

https://www.sfgate.com/entertainment/the-wrap/article/Obama-Portrait-Artist-Kehinde-Wiley-s-Once-12607940.php

but why can’t these dudes chop off some heads as well? Lol

Wouldn't be "presidential", though.

So no worries there.

Had no idea.

Props to Obama for higher and artist who courts some controversy. I don't think 08 Obama would have done that.





**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

But it's not so whatevs. Personally I think it's not the best look though.

On the portrait of Barack : "Why is he surrounded by flowers? Kinda weird. Oh it's Ivy. See? *Pulls out phone to hold google image of ivy plant next to picture of portrait because he is obsessed with being right all the time* Ah! Ok I see it now, it's like a nod to his ivy league background. #blackIvy president. Makes sense."

Me: "..."


On the portrait of Michelle : "Kinda boring. That dress is distracting. Wasn't there some article on that today?" *fiddles with phone to confirm because he is obsessed with being right all the time and discovers dress was designed by a young white woman* "Why would she choose some big distracting cotton dress by a white designer if she was trying to be all pro-black?" After which he concluded that maybe Michelle was giving a wink to commemorate that, yup, a descendent of enslaved black folks was First Lady - all up in that White House originally built with enslaved labour - and she employed a white woman to produce a cotton garment for HER.

Me: "..."

i wish more people had that obsession

He's the official factchecker

.