>Umar's audience appears to be working class/poor black folks with kids in public schools.<

OK. This is where it comes from and now I get it. I'll only say that that was never the lens through which I viewed his ______, but I see where you're coming from. If that is the case, then absolutely, there's a class piece that bears assessing.

>Those kids, especially the darker boys, have been in a crisis for a couple of decades now. There's a ton of data about that.

No one's arguing that. Not at all. Like no one's arguing the need.

>For some of those folks, the manifestation of homophobia and misogyny (cuz there's waaaaaay more than one manifestation)<

I'm choosing not to address this because the rabbit hole is too deep.

>...that Umar represents is irrelevant to their lives, and the schooling of their kids. Or at the very least, its something they're not pressed about.<

I mean... I guess I can see how misogyny and homophobia are a minor point in the overall need or desire to get their children a better education. And without being dismissive of that urgency, I submit that we, as a collective, should NOT see this as a minor point. It is WHOLLY problematic and doesn't serve those boys or the community.

>Matter of fact, the people who have been telling me about him THE MOST in the real world are blue collar single moms and public school teachers.<

Got it. By contrast, I know about him and his bullshit through totally different circles.

>Dude could very likely be Educational Rev. Ike. But instead of celebrating his downfall, ask why are the people so pressed for a different educational option?<

This is where, again, I take issue. I don't need you to explain this shit. What suggests that we -- those who want him to die in a fire -- don't get that? Who is pushing back against bottom up educational strategies for our children? Who thinks the need doesn't exist? It's offensive to suggest that just because I think he's a horror show and shouldn't be allowed to say 'children,' that that means I don't think the need is there. WTF?

>And what can be done to meet their needs? Why/what is he offering that seems so
attractive?<

100% with you here too.

>And if you think the answer to any of those questions is "an institutional hatred of women and gays", I'd say you're incredibly wrong.<

:-/ Again, I submit that this institutional hatred you say isn't the driver (and, for the record, I *might* grant you that), is AT MINIMUM a passenger on this ride and no one should be OK with that.

>Focus less on the man, and more on what the popularity of the man's goals means.<

The post was about him. I responded in kind because of the willful fucking ignorance of all of his supporters in this post. Your response was about the class distinction between his supporters and those who don't support him. I challenged that. Make a post about educating black children, and I'll respond to that as well.

>And if you need receipts on the Catholic church's misogyny, racism and homophobia...I really got no idea what to tell you.<

That's not what I said. I said -- somewhat facetiously -- that I need receipts on the Catholic church being "MORE" homophobic and misogynistic than this asshat. Size, age, and influence matter. But again... that's the minorest of points. I don't care about that, and have already agreed about the institutional shitshow that is the Catholic church. Again, I don't need you to educate me.