I think to avoid the appropriation label, you have to show a genuine appreciation for the culture AND the people that it came from by deliberately and proactively ACKNOWLEDGING them... GIVE as much as you TAKE from the culture... and be accepted by the culture.

With Bruno, I feel that he's been upfront about where he gets his musical inspiration from. I don't know how those guys feel about him though... and whether he's doing anything for them in the form of royalties, etc.

I don't feel like he's simply a shallow trend hopper like Vanilla Ice or a Miley Cyrus.

I would need to be clear on the following before positing an answer:

1st - definitions (feel free to correct as necessary):

appropriate - (verb) to take (something) for one's own use, typically without the owner's permission.

exploit - (verb) to make full use of and derive benefit from (a resource)

2nd - questions
a. in order to NOT appropriate Black culture, whose permission should one obtain?
b. how exactly are we defining "Black culture"? (seriously)

my answers:
appropriate - no (again, whose permission does He need to get? if the Black folks in his band say cool, is that enough?)
exploit - no (mainly because I would have a hard time identify what specifically of his whole deal is purely ours)

off topic questions i would have related to the subject:
1. can a Black person appropriate/exploit Black culture?
2. is exploitation or appropriation inherently a bad thing? if not - where exactly is the line before it BECOMES bad?
3. do some folks get passes (e.g. Teena Marie), and if so why?

and he gives credit where it's due



<=========================================
https://cdn0.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/PYzh4v9cSf4FDnq3yMQyqNqh79o=/800x0/filters:no_upscale%28%29/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/4079674/jlio.0.gif

it's watered down and sparkling pop music, but I believe his heart is in the right place

No...

Island boys been doing this thing here...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6fgVVlPl08

..I personally dig the homie's isht. He hasn't done anything to derail that with me, just yet.

he make some fun songs sometimes. but we have to call a spade a spade here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DeJgbd_a04

"Get ready....for your blessing....."

anything on a major scale to possibly get black youth somewhat interested in traditional R&B and funk. I'd bet money a bunch of black kids have dug into the Time, Lakeside, G.A.P. Band, etc. because of what he's been doing the last 3 or 4 years.

http://www.xxlmag.com/files/2017/02/Lil-Yachty-1.jpg
http://res.cloudinary.com/thefader/image/upload/Screen_Shot_2016-07-06_at_1.20.21_PM_bcp9d4.png

lol...

argument could be made there certainly

Let's say three kids grew up in Madison Wisconsin and they are all huge fans of Hip-Hop. One Kid is black, one kid is white and the other is Filipino.

They all got exposed to hip-hop the same way: BET, radio, the internet.

They all pursue music careers as rapper.

Can it be argued that the white kid is more guilty of cultural appropriation than the black or Filipino kid? Is the Filipino less guilty than the white kid?








**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

The one thing you've missed in their music exposure is what music was played at home.

Parents of the black, white and Filipino kids won't be playing the same music, and that makes a big influence on what music may create in the future.

"Get ready....for your blessing....."

hip-hop.

I think where you discover it, home versus the world, doesn't matter so much. As long as you genuinely come to it and appreciate it.

Vanilla Ice failed this test because Hip-hop wasn't his thing. It was something dreamed up at a record label.



>The one thing you've missed in their music exposure is what
>music was played at home.
>
>Parents of the black, white and Filipino kids won't be playing
>the same music, and that makes a big influence on what music
>may create in the future.
>


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

Neither would parents of different black kids...

one grows up on gospel

one grows up on 80s hits and R&B

one grows up on jazz and classical

one grows up on reggae

they all decide to rap though.. so

"Get ready....for your blessing....."

for Paul C. McKasty for the same reason.To find out now that early hip hop had multiple Rick Rubins makes me question the color monopoly in general as a rational-minded person.

>Let's say three kids grew up in Madison Wisconsin and they
>are all huge fans of Hip-Hop. One Kid is black, one kid is
>white and the other is Filipino.
>
>They all got exposed to hip-hop the same way: BET, radio, the
>internet.
>
>They all pursue music careers as rapper.
>
>Can it be argued that the white kid is more guilty of cultural
>appropriation than the black or Filipino kid? Is the Filipino
>less guilty than the white kid?

In your example, I don't see anyone actually appropriating anything.

I see appropriation when someone tries to change a fundamental aspect of hip-hop (in this case) in order to alter who is credited for it, who consumes it or how it's viewed.

White kid or Filipino kid creating or enjoying hip-hop? He's not appropriating anything.

White kid adding a country angle to hip-hop and saying that hip-hop has always been music for everybody? Nah, at that point he's changing some fundamental tenets of hip-hop in order to bring outsiders under the tent.

> White kid adding a country angle to hip-hop and saying that
>hip-hop has always been music for everybody? Nah, at that
>point he's changing some fundamental tenets of hip-hop in
>order to bring outsiders under the tent.


Interesting but I am having a problem with the notion that there are fundamental tenants of hip-hop. I think art is always changing and evolving. I think the best thing an artist can do is break the rules. I think the only rule is has to be dope, so if a white boy makes dope country rap and expands the definition of rap, I am with that. I think Eminem did that to a certain extent.


Here is what I think Cultural Appropriation is. Stealing peoples stuff and passing it off as your own. White Musicians going down to the Blues Delta listening to black bluesmen and then passing that music off as their own? That's Cultural Appropriation. Madonna learning Voguing from the gays and passing it off as her own? That's Cultural Appropriation. Miley Cyrus being credited for inventing twerking? That's Cultural Appropriation.

Now there is a thin line between an artist bringing a certain cultural practice to a larger audience while giving credit to the creators, I think that's okay. Maybe Madonna did that. I forget.





**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

.
>
>
>Here is what I think Cultural Appropriation is. Stealing
>peoples stuff and passing it off as your own. White
>Musicians going down to the Blues Delta listening to black
>bluesmen and then passing that music off as their own? That's
>Cultural Appropriation. Madonna learning Voguing from the
>gays and passing it off as her own? That's Cultural
>Appropriation. Miley Cyrus being credited for inventing
>twerking? That's Cultural Appropriation.
>
>Now there is a thin line between an artist bringing a certain
>cultural practice to a larger audience while giving credit to
>the creators, I think that's okay. Maybe Madonna did that. I
>forget.
>

That's where I'm at with it. Bruno credits Black music as the foundation of American music, including Puerto Rican music. Cultural appropriation rarely or doesn't give credit to the source at all. They'd rather take the credit for themselves.


Since 1976

vs the artist? mind you, I don't follow miley or bruno much, but have either of them ever claimed a style as their own that clearly came from other influences? anybody with any sense knows that miley aint created no damn twerking. lol. even madonna....did she ever tell folks that she created Vogue?

a lot of those white artists that went down in the Delta also gave credit to the artists they pulled from. the rolling stones have always talked about where they got their style from. as has bruce springsteen.

point is, I think the media and the unaware audiences push the narrative of who created what rather than the artists themselves.

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

there is nothing wrong with being from the midwest or the burbs and doing rap.

I don't see that for Bruno. He's a talented and gifted fan. I will say ONE thing tho. I've never seen him with a Black person, off stage. So this character that he is cosplaying in his songs is a little problematic.

but at the same time I'm having a hard time making a case for Bruno.

i dunno, it just SEEMS like he is authentically into black stuff and is invested

none of this would hold up in court though.

sounded just like Bruno Mars sang those songs and performed the way Bruno does he wouldn't be taken seriously.

But because its a latino-asian guy with curly hair that acts like a black dude surrounded by his black band/backup dancers/hypemen people think its something special.

There is no all around better performer and songwriter than Bruno Mars currently (int he commercial space) ..

As talented as Phil (Bruno writing partner in smeezingtons) is he is on 10 with Bruno involved...

Anderson, C Breezy and Janelle are as dope performance wise and Janelle got some of the same looks as Bruno early one but end of the day

his songs are on smash..

So you can say it wouldn't happen but there is no one to even compare it too..

Chris Brown could be one of the biggest artists on the planet with his talent.. but A. he gets in his own way and B. His songs dont hit like that

Which is a shame, but I can't think of a Male artist who is going after the BBQ music that the parents, grandparents and children can all listen to like Michael Jackson.

When a new Chris Brown track pops up on my spotify I got to run and cut if off before my kids hear:

Why your pussy so damn good, miss lady?
Go and put that booty up, baby, one on one
You know I'ma go crazy when your legs in the air
You know your panties never getting in the way
You know I kinda like it, when you make me work for it


>There is no all around better performer and songwriter than
>Bruno Mars currently (int he commercial space) ..
>
>As talented as Phil (Bruno writing partner in smeezingtons) is
>he is on 10 with Bruno involved...
>
>Anderson, C Breezy and Janelle are as dope performance wise
>and Janelle got some of the same looks as Bruno early one but
>end of the day
>
>his songs are on smash..
>
>So you can say it wouldn't happen but there is no one to even
>compare it too..
>
>Chris Brown could be one of the biggest artists on the planet
>with his talent.. but A. he gets in his own way and B. His
>songs dont hit like that


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

Ha...

and its a shame cuz C Breezy really has the talent to be on some crazy big shit

had no choice but to the bad boy route. Before that his career was on an amazing trajectory, Forever was becoming the default white folk wedding song, he was starting to acting roles, then it all came crashing down. And he's still having an amazing career by normal standards but he could've been so much more.

once those pics came out it was over. if it wasnt so severe i think he could've recovered.

Nah...

Deuces, Loyal, Post To Be, Look At Me Now, were HUGE Post Rih

Think Like A Man was Post Rih

Chris stopped making big records and everything else outside of music fucks his scenario up

>Nah...
>
>Deuces, Loyal, Post To Be, Look At Me Now, were HUGE Post
>Rih
>
>Think Like A Man was Post Rih
>
>Chris stopped making big records and everything else outside
>of music fucks his scenario up

No doubt he's had success post Rih but I think he could've been even bigger in the mainstream lane, after the Rih shit he seemed to veer back into the "R&B bad boy" mode. I feel like he could've done mainstream movies and tv also but after Rih white people weren't fucking with him like that.

I agree that white folks "felt a way" after that...

at the same time he couldve weathered that storm..

I mean Rihanna post fight... became BadGallRiRi to much success.. she kept making hits though..

He stopped and KEPT up with the bullshit with karruche and all that

http://www.billboard.com/files/styles/article_main_image/public/stylus/500186-bruno_mars_mugshot_617_409.jpg

Not going to say there's colorism happening on top of racism with white America but he's about as accepted as this dude was pre-rihanna.

http://crazy-frankenstein.com/free-wallpapers-files/male-celebrity/chris-brown-wallpapers/chris-brown-young-wallpapers-1600x1200.jpg

He would still get pulled over by the cops and arrested for some bullshit (which he was, lol). Not sure how a half puerto rican, half filipino is suddenly not allowed to do black music; we got hella spanish guitar songs from the '00's we owe royalties on then, LOL

its more of the performance lane he tries to be in when you see him perform songs like Uptown Funk & 24K Magic with the hats and shades and gold chains surrounded by the "brothas" jumping and dancing he's like a caricature of a black man. If an actual black man was doing that it would be called "cooning".

He has had the same band since day one... his ACTUAL brother is on the drums

Phillip Lawrence co-writes and co-produces with him in all those records..

think its reaching just to reach

from "the lazy song" and "you're amazing just the way to are"

to

"uptown funk"

"24 carat"

and "that's what I like"


is like night and day


so....


to make a leap like that seems kinda fake if there doesn't seem to be a good reason for it.

>from "the lazy song" and "you're amazing just the way to
>are"
>
>to
>
>"uptown funk"
>
>"24 carat"
>
>and "that's what I like"
>
>
>is like night and day
>
>
>so....
>
>
>to make a leap like that seems kinda fake if there doesn't
>seem to be a good reason for it.
>
>

Did you forget Treasure existed?

I think on unorthodox jukebox when Treasure blew the fuck up and was the prototype for Uptown Funk he just kinda ran with the lane... outside of say Chromeo and Mayer Hawthorne it wasnt being touched at mainstream

its more fun to practice and perform dance moves with your homies than sit at a piano and belt out ballads anyway...

people are mad at him for bringing funk, soul, and disco into contemporary music?

thats a new one for me

before Bruno did "Treasure" called "give a little more"

I played that MP3 of "give a little more" by Maroon 5 quite often, so I seemed to be happy they brought that MJ-style into the 21st century.

but...

Maroon started their career in that vein (I know as Kara's Flowers they were more "rock" but as Maroon 5.....)

so they seem "genuine" with it

whereas...

Bruno started with "lazy song" and "you're amazing just the way you are"

so

that pipsqueaky "treasure" song didn't seem to warrant that recent caricaturish shift to me.


Some things come off as "working" (Maroon 5) and some don't (24 carat)

Maroon 5 is also not "sunday morning" maroon 5 anymore either..

M5 is adam levine singing whatever song was written and produced for him featuring some guys that then pkay those songs on the road...

Everyone transitions

Bruno is here for hits.. for a great song.. no gossip... no bullshit... he gives you hits and then hes gone.

His authenticity is based solely on writing smashes... and performing the shitoutnof them.. thats it

progressed in a manner that seems (seemed) "organic" or "natural" or "reasonable" or whether the transitions were "jarring" or "off-putting"

The Red Hot Chili Peppers obviously changed over the years due to band members dying or leaving but most would say their transitions seemed "reasonable"

The band Fishbone however put a lot of heavy rock songs on their "give a monkey a brain..." album and one friend of mine who recently got into Fishbone from an album that had some rock songs on it ("truth and soul") reacted to "Give a monkey a brain..." by saying "that's not Fishbone"



that's how transitions can work or not work.

For sure....

Imo the transition from unorthodox jukebox to 24kt is natural... he went from early to mid 80s hits to late 80s early 90s hits..

People forget uptown funk is not a bruno idea.. its a mark ronson/jeff bhasker one that bruno and phil executed incredibly...

Once that happened it solidified the idea that bruno could bring 80s r&b (that was never on pop radio) to the masses again..

and thats what he is doing

and it seems like everything he does is a hit

I guess its because we are used to Black artist being strictly R&B.. or rap.

How dare this dude do some slow shit, some melodic shit, some funky shit, some rock shit and all of it sells.

Its not fair, he's cheating..

then came back with Kid A.

When I went to Tower records to buy it at 12:01 AM I heard a banging programmed drum and asked who the fuck was that playing?

Its Radiohead

Totally

Different

Sound

He cant change lanes or genres because????

Thats just dumb

or at least one very prevalent influence

acting like Morris Day yes he would be called a coon.

he didnt ask you what he would be called.

being something and being called something are not the same

ThaTruth didn't even say what Bruno is or isn't.
He said what he'd be called... so he stuck to
the conversation he initiated.
I mean since we're convo policing and all.

It's not as cool when a black man does what Bruno does because black men are supposed to be funky

Same reason Adele gets the love she does. It's not special when black women are soulful.

because a major selling point with Neo Soul was about a revival

He is a darker shade then Buddy and held my fam on my Dads side.

Not sure how folks put Adele and Bruno in the same convo.

LQQK @ his pic>>>> http://brownsugar7341.bizhosting.com.bizhosting.com/cgi-bin/image/templates/BrunoMars.jpg

Puerto Rican, Asian w/Black sprinkled on top...Ooop, there it is :D :D :D !!!

BM ain't shakin' or fakin' his Black side...I love him :-) :-) :-) !!!



♥ :* I LUV U 2!!! :* ♥

Since 1976

I mean..

Maybe if he does an ancestry dna test thing..

Puerto Ricans may or may not have African blood.

Filipinos may or may not have African blood.

It's not outside the realm of possibility.

Shame on everyone chiming in positively on this thread. Your whole worldview will be dead in 5 years. At which time....you will claim to have never held it. For now...shame.

Any other argument I make against this premise is like fighting a ghost. A pale, light-skinned ghost.

There WILL be a race to centrist liberal values. Meet you there.

Is that you don't really know what the hell you're talking about and need to shut the entire fuck up in these topics because you're just another alt-right buffoon with a severe detachment to anything outside the cherry-picking assed ideology to which you subsribe?

WHEW

That's a relief

I'm glad to see you finally arrived at that conclusion on your own and nobody had to actually tell you.

I'm glad we had this talk and look forward to you keeping your word on this.

too much biting, just not my type of vibe.

I kinda liked his first album. now it just seems like he's play acting.

turkeys acting like Michael Jackson ain't threw a nod in his light is wrong.

Bruno is the real deal though the only knock i got is that he has to do more real songs and i would say one more uptempo album based and then just keep on writing better and better.

the cat can bring it live and he is the truth he just has to take more of a Bobby brown attitude and not be one of the fellas and that is what a true lead "It" act understands and gets.

??????????



"Get ready....for your blessing....."

I haven't been to a show but I enjoy his performances as the SB and award shows.

all that being said, dude is kind of a biter. Seems like all his hits are blatant rip offs of old hits.

he does it well tho and he pays up

nm

and i dug 24k magic a lot

about all of us growing up on the same music.

https://twitter.com/9thwonder/status/973156067747254272


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

...he can't *appropriate his own shit.

Afro-Americans really need to learn a lot more about Afro-Latinos.
Black is Black whether you are an African descendant in North America(United States), or an African descendant in South America(Latin America).

That arguments ("we're all black!") works until one considers African-Americans (capital Bs) as a unique and separate culture Which a lot of people apparently loath to do).

Since we're talking CULTURE here and not RACE, the it's very valid to wonder:

a) Was Bruno Mars actually raised within Af-Am culture? In Hawaii?

b) If not, then he's definitely copying the culture (not gonna go as far as appropriation, because he seems to cite his sources).

>That arguments ("we're all black!") works until one considers
>African-Americans (capital Bs) as a unique and separate
>culture Which a lot of people apparently loath to do).
>
>Since we're talking CULTURE here and not RACE, the it's very
>valid to wonder:
>
>a) Was Bruno Mars actually raised within Af-Am culture? In
>Hawaii?
>

>b) If not, then he's definitely copying the culture (not gonna
>go as far as appropriation, because he seems to cite his
>sources).
>
So... without the cultural exchange from Black Caribbeans, African Americans, Afro Latinos and Latinos we would not have Hip Hop, Bossa Nova, Reggae, Reggaeton, Dance Music etc...

This link has existed and goes both ways... He isnt biting shit because the conversation is continuous and has always gone both ways...

EDIT: As a larger conversation piece I do agree that it should be accepted and understood that African American's are a distinct ethnicity in the same way that Jamaicans and Guyanese are. The Diaspora can exist as a collective while still recognizing and respecting unique cultural differences.

Folks need to slow down with this shit.

I listened to a video of the woman ckaiming Bruno was a vulture. She said if Michael Jackson came out in 2018 he wouldnt be as popular.

Man, these people just mad and throsing shit at the wall, seeing what sticks

I hate that they are so reductionist..

Generations literally grew up with AND watched Michael Jackson grow up. He was embedded into the psyche of my moms generation (parents are 60). People talmbout MTV when MTV wasn't even MTV Like how we know it before Mike came through and made it so.

We have no modern music examples of MJ black, white or otherwise to compare him to. There isnt anyone in 20th or 21st century outside of child actors that have lived that long in the zeitgeist.

SIDENOTE:

Funny shit is cats watched "The Breakdown" and didn't say shit about what the characters were "ethnically". For everything it got wrong that is what it got all the way right. The melting pot made this shit we cherish today.

Theh want everything to be (B)lack but refuse to admit some of the orignators were (b)lack.

and whats really frustrating is a lot of these internet activist arent creating much more than vlogs and lazy think pieces.

There was someone on twitter who also brought up...

A lot of these loud and wrong kids are cul de sac kids. They didn't exist IN the experience. A lot of it might be them trying to reconcile their blackness and class privilege because they didnt grow up in "the shits".

real question is anyone who sparks these convos in the real hood at a barbershop doing it?

>There was someone on twitter who also brought up...
>
>A lot of these loud and wrong kids are cul de sac kids. They
>didn't exist IN the experience. A lot of it might be them
>trying to reconcile their blackness and class privilege
>because they didnt grow up in "the shits".
>
>real question is anyone who sparks these convos in the real
>hood at a barbershop doing it?

You can't limit people based on that.

I am not...

THEY are... their perception of their own Blackness is seen through the lens of Pop Culture Black.

I have a friend who is African garbed out.

She wasnt even allowed to hang at the black community center growing up.

She went to a HBCU and got turned out

Now all her kids have african names and she is pro blackitty black black black. She is all about our people and teaches the youth.. good person all around but she went all the way in.

...Jamaican, Guyanese, Brasillian, etc. because "we're all black" and *my* influences are from those places (which is actually true for me)?

Would my (practiced) Jamaican accent be just "honoring" because I grew up listening to Jacob Miller? If I worked on my accent and started singing, would I be seen as a fake? (Jafakin')

Could I dress like this: https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-yNzJsDLGl1w/VwvPgVxAXMI/AAAAAAAACcQ/BfvYSJVRbss0vQ3z8IKWW9UnW3b1pviNg/s1600/IMG-20160403-WA0068.jpg
without being insulted as a "culture vulture" or a "hotepper?"

Can I rep Pittsburgh's slang, energy and culture even though I've never even been there, but am a fan of the city and watched "Fences?"



If the answers are "yes" then I have no argument.

Hes from Charlottesville. I think they usually win best reggae band in Richmond or VA.

I also know a white reggae band from DC who tours all over the world.

While I think its hilarious because none of them are Jamaican I also think folks dont really care as kong as the music sounds good.

Jamaicans might be offended tho.

I grew up in thr burbs outside of Pittsburgh. Pitsburgh slang pretty nuch sounds like Cali slang. Think of Whiz Kalifa. If thats how you want to sound I don't give a shit.


I went to college with a bunch of ethnicities at VCU. Women went thru phases, dressed in the african garb and dudes had the Jafaken accents. Some of them still rock that dhjt and their kids have African names even tho the grew up in the burbs.

If thats the life you want to live I wont stop you from doing it. Just try to be sensitive and respect the culture you are trying to emulate.


Ionno man, judt dont ckap back like Iggy Azelia whe someone challenges you or questions your intent.

I think if folk ask Bruno about music history he isnt going to be a dear in headlights. Folks act like Bruno is on some "who's Teddy Riley?"


I think one has to do their homework and really be about it. Dont be in African garb and slide thru with a white girl.

Or "stealing." I do think he's emulating somewhat tho. Nothing wrong with that at all (see my comment in the Quincy Jones/Mike Jackson post).

I go hard in these posts because I CONSTANTLY see a version this logic:

Black American culture == "hip hop" == hip hop is by/for everyone! == Black American culture is *everyone's* culture == Black Americans have no culture (so how could anyone appropriate what didn't exist in the first place?).


Every time. It's like a lot of people are offended by the notion of Black Americans having agency.

>

>Black American culture == "hip hop" == hip hop is by/for
>everyone! == Black American culture is *everyone's* culture
>== Black Americans have no culture (so how could anyone
>appropriate what didn't exist in the first place?).
>

Yea I hope that the arguments in this post were not trying to convey that. Cuz that'd be a fucking leap.

>...Jamaican, Guyanese, Brasillian, etc. because "we're all
>black" and *my* influences are from those places (which is
>actually true for me)?
>
>Would my (practiced) Jamaican accent be just "honoring"
>because I grew up listening to Jacob Miller? If I worked on my
>accent and started singing, would I be seen as a fake?
>(Jafakin')
>
>Could I dress like this:
>https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-yNzJsDLGl1w/VwvPgVxAXMI/AAAAAAAACcQ/BfvYSJVRbss0vQ3z8IKWW9UnW3b1pviNg/s1600/IMG-20160403-WA0068.jpg
>without being insulted as a "culture vulture" or a
>"hotepper?"
>
>Can I rep Pittsburgh's slang, energy and culture even though
>I've never even been there, but am a fan of the city and
>watched "Fences?"
>

We do this all the time. "Thot" was a chicago slang that went national, Saying "Yo" clearly started in NY. Everyone saying "man dem", "mans dem", "ting" currently are all using Jamaican terms. Kid N Play (NYC) as a group blew up off Go Go styled records (DC). The Fugees were 2 Haitians and an American Black woman in love with Jamaican dancehall culture and utilized the communication and merging with Hip hop for success.

she kinda lost herself and ended up heartbroken chasing after a Marley.

She went all the way in.

I may be wrong about it but I seem to remember her relationship didn’t end well.

That 'Black vs. black' nonsense has always been ridiculous and invalid.

>That arguments ("we're all black!") works until one considers
>African-Americans (capital Bs) as a unique and separate
>culture Which a lot of people apparently loath to do)

What you are speaking of right ^^there is *nationality, NOT ethnicity. Black people in North America need to learn the distinction. Because that type of ignorance is what had Charlamagne confused about Amara La Negra on breakfast club, but I digress.



Semantics be damn, here is the facts(as opposed to opinion):

We are all Black(as in: African, of the indigenous African ethnic groups that have been dispersed into the Americas involuntarily< < <that is a fact, not an opinion)The disconnect is, a lot of Black people in America don't know the difference between ethnicity and nationality(<this is where the disconnect is).

So when I say, Bruno is Black, I'm not talking about his nationality(you are), I'm talking about his ethnicity(of which, Bruno is poly-ethnic or multi-ethnic since he has African, Asian and European blood in him).

>That 'Black vs. black' nonsense has always been ridiculous
>and invalid.
>
>>That arguments ("we're all black!") works until one
>considers
>>African-Americans (capital Bs) as a unique and separate
>>culture Which a lot of people apparently loath to do)
>
>What you are speaking of right ^^there is *nationality, NOT
>ethnicity. Black people in North America need to learn the
>distinction. Because that type of ignorance is what had
>Charlamagne confused about Amara La Negra on breakfast club,
>but I digress.
>
>
>
>Semantics be damn, here is the facts(as opposed to opinion):
>
>We are all Black(as in: African, of the indigenous African
>ethnic groups that have been dispersed into the Americas
>involuntarily< < <that is a fact, not an opinion)The
>disconnect is, a lot of Black people in America don't know the
>difference between ethnicity and nationality(<this is where
>the disconnect is).
>

Do they wanna be Black ? Do those on the islands and the continent of Africa embrace Black(as in: African, of the indigenous African
>ethnic groups that have been dispersed into the Americas
>involuntarily) ?

https://www.npr.org/2018/03/13/593272215/for-the-first-time-2020-census-will-ask-black-americans-about-their-exact-origin


>So when I say, Bruno is Black, I'm not talking about his
>nationality(you are), I'm talking about his ethnicity(of
>which, Bruno is poly-ethnic or multi-ethnic since he has
>African, Asian and European blood in him).
>
>

Does Bruno say he is Black ?

:p

His father is purported to be half puerto rican, from Brookly NY = black

"Mars is one of six children and came from a musical family which exposed him to a diverse mix of genres including: reggae, rock, hip hop, and R&B. His mother was both a singer and a dancer, and his father performed Little Richard rock and roll music. Mars' uncle was an Elvis impersonator, and also encouraged three-year-old Mars to perform on stage. Mars performed songs by artists such as Michael Jackson, The Isley Brothers, and The Temptations. At the age of four, Mars began performing five days a week with his family's band, The Love Notes, and became known on the island for his impersonation of Presley. In 1990, Mars was featured in MidWeek as "Little Elvis", and later appeared in a cameo role in the film Honeymoon in Vegas (1992), and performed in the halftime show of the 1990 Aloha Bowl."

AT THE AGE OF FOUR HE WAS PERFORMING 5 DAYS A WEEK WITH HIS FAMILY'S BAND COVERING SONGS BY MJ, THE ISLEYS AND TEMPS

Yes, that how it works.

but folks act like he just got on 5 years ago.

Dude wrote a lot of songs for different artist too.

He’s just one of those artist who has been at it so long they can do al types of genres.

My partner from back in the day can freestyle with the best of them. Dude just wrote a KPOP song. He can write love songs, real, rap, rock, etc.

Some people are just gifted.

from within the industry because he's Latino.. which in and of itself is fucked up because as others have said, hip hop culture originated due to confluence of people from multiple cultural backgrounds including Latinos.

It's sad to watch members of the Black community relish in using the same exclusionary tactics that have been used against them.

I mean, the man was forced to change his name because industry heads couldn't wrap their head around a dude named Hernandez singing R&B (from his wiki):

"In a cover story for Entertainment Weekly, Mars stated that the song "Nothin' on You" was rejected by a "music industry decision-maker" (a person he won't name) because of his race. That experience made him feel like a "mutant", and he says that was his lowest point. "Even with that song in my back pocket to seal the deal, things like that are coming out of people's mouths. It made me feel like I wasn't even in the room." In April 2013, in a cover story for GQ magazine, Mars confessed that he changed his surname because people in the music industry took him as another Latino artist, and even tried to convince him to sing in Spanish saying: "Your last name's Hernandez, maybe you should do the Latin music, this Spanish music... Enrique is so hot right now”. Nevertheless, Mars used his childhood nickname Bruno and changed his surname to Mars, in an effort to "avoid being stereotyped"

I do have some thoughts on it.

I have mixed feelings on the "appropriation" tag for him. I mean the definition literally fits, considering he was almost sued for jacking folks stuff... but then he paid up. What I do like about him is that he's gives credit to the originators of the sounds he's using. He's not afraid to do that. I don't know if I've ever heard of him addressing how his racially ambiguous or "exotic" looks contribute to his success, but I'd respect that. I can imagine that that's hard for him, because he actually is talented, and he might not want to imply that it was anything other than his hard work that opened doors for him or allows non-black folks to connect/relate to him, but... I'll just leave it at that.

As for my feelings on his music, I'll use something I saw in his Super Bowl performance in 2014. He did this paint-by-numbers James Brown imitation where he moved his feet, spun, and did a split. He did that whole sequence twice, but he did it exactly the same way both times. Like he was counting the steps to the move... as if he learned the sequence just for the performance... no feeling, no soul... just an obviously planned "improvisation." It amazed me that there were people who were impressed with that. It looked completely canned to me. But just the fact that he did it at all kinda got him a participation award in some ppl's eyes. That paint-by-numbers approach is how I see everything he does. He's found the keys to imitating people but not the soul. It's just someone going through the motions. He's like the JAY PHAROAH of music to me. He can imitate anyone and sound exactly like them. Jay can sound exactly like Denzel Washington, but he can't imitate his acting skill. Jay can imitate Eddie Murphy, but he can't be Eddie Murphy funny. Bruno can imitate MJ, Bobby Brown, James Brown, etc, but he can't be as soulful as them. Bruno goes as far as his talent can take him, and many of his songs are enjoyable... I mean, he's imitating the best. People talk about how he's got it honest because he grew up IMITATING Elvis. So lemme get this straight... he's true to Black soulfulness because he grew up imitating an imitator of Black soul? I swear people don't think their ideas through, lol. But here's the other thing that gives him away... he didn't come in the game doing this "Black soul" act he's doing now. He was a folksy pop guy at first. Then Uptown Funk hit and he stuck with it, because it hit. Consider this... James Brown came in the industry having to make the kinds of songs that were being recorded at the time. He eventually changed his sound, because his soul wouldn't let him keep doing something he didn't feel. When his own sound caught on, he changed music. Bruno changed his sound because of a song that was handed to him. He didn't revolutionize the game... he just kept getting his sound from elsewhere (as in imitating). He just sounds like exactly what he is... someone who doesn't have their own sound. Canned music, canned dance moves... paint-by-numbers. Other people innovated these things... he just imitates them. Yeah it's fun, enjoyable etc, b/c he's a good imitator who imitating fun and enjoyable artists... so when Meshell Ndegeocello says he's singing karaoke, that makes complete sense to me. He came up doing exactly that, right? If you wanna talk about just "who he is" it's an imitator at heart. He's trained for it since he was 6, correct? I don't see him having moved beyond that.

He counts his steps while performing?

Lmao

Pretty sure that's on purpose tho.
It's like you didn't read past the first 4 sentences or so of the 2nd paragraph.

That's whatever tho.

Shit read like a transcript for one of those youtube conspiracy theorist videos about how celebs being in the illuminati LMAO matching shapes as evidence

I love that because we don't agree we dont understand

----------

IG @h_n_z

He thinks dude is a paint by number artist who counts his steps. A performer but nothing originally or soulful...

I dont agree.

No 2 entertainers are alike.

The whole "he did his lil move and folks acted like it was the greatest thing.." (I'm paraphrasing, I know Boogie will say that isnt exactly what he said) but that point is weird to me. Folks prolly thought it was great because it looked good AND he was jamming.

I think the main issue with Bruno is before that SB performance folks had low expectations or thought he was corny. He came out and rocked that shit. Regardless if you like or hate him his SB peformance was top 5. I had low expectations and he surprised the hell out of me.

Doesnt mean he is James Brown level or Prince level but dude did his thing.

Its unfortunate to see folks knock him like this.

>I do have some thoughts on it.
>
>I have mixed feelings on the "appropriation" tag for him. I
>mean the definition literally fits, considering he was almost
>sued for jacking folks stuff... but then he paid up. What I
>do like about him is that he's gives credit to the originators
>of the sounds he's using. He's not afraid to do that. I
>don't know if I've ever heard of him addressing how his
>racially ambiguous or "exotic" looks contribute to his
>success, but I'd respect that. I can imagine that that's hard
>for him, because he actually is talented, and he might not
>want to imply that it was anything other than his hard work
>that opened doors for him or allows non-black folks to
>connect/relate to him, but... I'll just leave it at that.
>
>As for my feelings on his music, I'll use something I saw in
>his Super Bowl performance in 2014. He did this
>paint-by-numbers James Brown imitation where he moved his
>feet, spun, and did a split. He did that whole sequence
>twice, but he did it exactly the same way both times. Like he
>was counting the steps to the move... as if he learned the
>sequence just for the performance... no feeling, no soul...
>just an obviously planned "improvisation." It amazed me that
>there were people who were impressed with that. It looked
>completely canned to me. But just the fact that he did it at
>all kinda got him a participation award in some ppl's eyes.
>That paint-by-numbers approach is how I see everything he
>does. He's found the keys to imitating people but not the
>soul. It's just someone going through the motions. He's like
>the JAY PHAROAH of music to me. He can imitate anyone and
>sound exactly like them. Jay can sound exactly like Denzel
>Washington, but he can't imitate his acting skill. Jay can
>imitate Eddie Murphy, but he can't be Eddie Murphy funny.
>Bruno can imitate MJ, Bobby Brown, James Brown, etc, but he
>can't be as soulful as them. Bruno goes as far as his talent
>can take him, and many of his songs are enjoyable... I mean,
>he's imitating the best. People talk about how he's got it
>honest because he grew up IMITATING Elvis. So lemme get this
>straight... he's true to Black soulfulness because he grew up
>imitating an imitator of Black soul? I swear people don't
>think their ideas through, lol. But here's the other thing
>that gives him away... he didn't come in the game doing this
>"Black soul" act he's doing now. He was a folksy pop guy at
>first. Then Uptown Funk hit and he stuck with it, because it
>hit. Consider this... James Brown came in the industry having
>to make the kinds of songs that were being recorded at the
>time. He eventually changed his sound, because his soul
>wouldn't let him keep doing something he didn't feel. When
>his own sound caught on, he changed music. Bruno changed his
>sound because of a song that was handed to him. He didn't
>revolutionize the game... he just kept getting his sound from
>elsewhere (as in imitating). He just sounds like exactly what
>he is... someone who doesn't have their own sound. Canned
>music, canned dance moves... paint-by-numbers. Other people
>innovated these things... he just imitates them. Yeah it's
>fun, enjoyable etc, b/c he's a good imitator who imitating fun
>and enjoyable artists... so when Meshell Ndegeocello says he's
>singing karaoke, that makes complete sense to me. He came up
>doing exactly that, right? If you wanna talk about just "who
>he is" it's an imitator at heart. He's trained for it since
>he was 6, correct? I don't see him having moved beyond that.

He pays his dues but I wonder if anyone he pays tribute to would feel they can learn something from his music that they can apply to there's?

What's the distinctive Bruno "sound" or "voice" that makes his peers think "Hmm, I need him to write or produce for me?" (Which I believe he does).

I think the perceived lack of contribution to the music world is part of what makes many feel he's an appropriator.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SR6iYWJxHqs

https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/12/entertainment/bruno-mars-cultural-appropriation-reaction-trnd/index.html

After Bruno Mars is accused of cultural appropriation, black celebrities come to his defense
Deena Zaru
By Deena Zaru, CNN
Updated 5:51 AM EDT, Tue March 13, 2018

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02:10 - Source: HLN
Bruno Mars accused of cultural appropriation (2018)
CNN
—
Bruno Mars found himself caught in a heated debate about cultural appropriation over the weekend after an activist accused the “24K Magic” star of being a culture vulture profiting off of traditionally black music.

“Cultural appropriation,” according to the Cambridge Dictionary, is “the act of taking or using things from a culture that is not your own, especially without showing that you understand or respect this culture.”

Bruno Mars’ mother is Filipina and his father is Puerto Rican and Jewish


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But the Grammy-winning star is known for blending elements of funk, soul, R&B, reggae and hip-hop in his music — genres that are historically and traditionally African-American.

Here’s the two-minute video that started it all:

“Bruno Mars 100% is a cultural appropriator. He is not black, at all, and he plays up his racial ambiguity to cross genres,” writer and activist Seren Sensei said in a clip for “The Grapevine,” a web series that explores African-American issues.

“What Bruno Mars does, is he takes pre-existing work and he just completely, word-for-word recreates it, extrapolates it,” she added. “He does not create it, he does not improve upon it, he does not make it better. He’s a karaoke singer, he’s a wedding singer, he’s the person you hire to do Michael Jackson and Prince covers. Yet Bruno Mars has an Album of the Year Grammy and Prince never won an Album of the Year Grammy.”

Some agreed with Sensei.


“Yeah, she makes a valid point about the appropriation of blackness and how it is now lucrative rather than taboo. Bruno Mars as an example is an awkward one because he has paid homage but that doesn’t discredit that he can still benefit from the ambiguity,” one Twitter user wrote.

For more on music, culture and politics, check out CNN’s #GetPolitical series.

Meanwhile, others jumped to Mars’ defense.

“I just want to be practical here. Are people saying that Bruno Mars shouldn’t sing? Or that when he sings he needs to somehow whiten that s— up and sound more like Rod Stewart,” “Black Lives Matter” activist and writer Shaun King tweeted. “I’m dead serious. What type of music is this man “allowed” to do?”

R&B singer Charlie Wilson, one of the black artists Mars is accused of copying, praised the musician in a Twitter message and credited him with helping to “bring back that classic New Jack / R&B sound to the masses when it was left for dead years ago and hard for artists to get that sound back on mainstream radar.”


Wilson – the former lead vocalist of R&B/funk group The Gap Band – also praised “24K Magic,” which won Mars six Grammys this year, saying, “Bruno’s songs on this album are original and no different from any other artist pulling inspiration from genres before him.”

In defending Mars, fans pointed to statements the artist made paying tribute to the black pioneers who inspired his music.

“When you say ‘black music,’ understand that you are talking about rock, jazz, R&B, reggae, funk, doo-wop, hip-hop and Motown,” he said in a February 2017 interview with Latina magazine.”Black people created it all. Being Puerto Rican, even salsa music stems back to the Motherland . So, in my world, black music means everything. It’s what gives America its swag.


The made up Cardi B-Nicki Minaj feud feeds into an insidious form of sexism
“I’m a child raised in the ’90s,” he continued. Pop music was heavily rooted in R&B from Whitney, Diddy, Dr. Dre, Boyz II Men, Aaliyah, TLC, Babyface, New Edition, Michael, and so much more … I wouldn’t be here if it wasn’t for these artists who inspired me.”

Mars, who dashed hip-hop’s Grammy dreams in January when he won album, record and song of the year, also got some words of encouragement from the hip-hop community.

“Keep making that funky ish, @BrunoMars!!!! Do you always ❤️,” Grammy-nominated rapper Rapsody tweeted.

“So is it Bruno Mars fault that…he was influenced by BabyFace, Teddy Riley, Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis…around the same time from a hip-hop side I was influenced by DJ Premier, Pete Rock, and The Beatminerz? This is a Sociology study on influence and exposure….” hip-hop music producer 9th Wonder tweeted.

Mars, who has collaborated with many hip-hop artists – most recently, Cardi B – called on Atlanta to select a hip-hop artist to perform at next year’s Super Bowl.

White musicians such as rapper Iggy Azalea and Miley Cyrus, who tried her hand at hip-hop as she rose to fame and then openly distanced herself from it, have often been cast as culture vultures.

Most recently, white rapper Post Malone sparked a wave of backlash from the hip-hop community after he appeared to dis the genre that made him famous, in a January interview with GQ.

“I definitely feel like there’s a struggle being a white rapper. But I don’t want to be a rapper. I just want to be a person that makes music,” he said.

interesting

some Adobo or Goya

let that shit go...

it was always a reach given dudes background and talent

kinda like Kanye hanging out with Trump wearing MAGA hats

I I could see if he had an all white band and didn’t fuck with Black people but nah fam..

you missed.

>I I could see if he had an all white band and didn’t fuck
>with Black people but nah fam..
>
>you missed.

if you watched him when he first came out and what he turned into its really undeniable.

You mean the label that signed him made him do pop music. Look at the time he came out as an artist. Smh

>You mean the label that signed him made him do pop music.
>Look at the time he came out as an artist. Smh

That’s who he was, I actually listened to him before he became “popular”.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SR6iYWJxHqs

This is too dumb to argue but all you have to do is look at this video of his evolution.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaMzYv7qsFE

Nevermind what he was performing as a child (He said his dad was a big elvis fan) as soon as he was a older and performing music as a teen he was doing black music before he had a record deal.

But forget what you might find in a gotcha clip, the man regularly cites James Brown, Michael Jackson, Prince as his musical influences and it shows in everyone of his performances.

Using what he dropped when he was first signed by a big label and had AR controlling his look and output is dumb. There are millions of story why that doesn't work.

Stop.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

and that clip being posted in a thread about him appropriating Black music. Not just posted... but posted in his defense. LMAO.

Might be the most ass-backward defense one could possibly conjure.

I find him rather harmless all things considered, but damn that's crazy.

Baby Bruno spoke the appropriation accusation into existence lol. I'm trippin on that.

So you mean the guy who wanted to be a pop star made the type of pop music for the label wanted? Yeah, that’s never happened before LMAO stop being weird.

Most artist are robots until they get their second deal or get more freedom to be creative.

I’m sure the bean counters were like “r&b????” you can’t sell major units doing that shit.

first came out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7_3tlhlm78


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c2/World_Class_Wreckin%27_Cru.jpeg

but whoever thought he'd be able to pull off an LL Cool J/Big Daddy Kane vibe for Ladies should have been fired.

Even his sex songs on the Bobby Digital albums were awkward AF, he should stick to rapping about chess and sword fights